Arm the Nation
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Carrot Cruncher
Re: Arm the Nation
It's already legal to own firearms in the UK, you just have to jump through some hoops to get a certificate.....just dont mention to the policeman who comes round for a chat that you want one to wipeout the zombie hoards who are after your stash
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Red Doe
Re: Arm the Nation
There`s the prohibitive cost of the firearms certificate too to take into account.
(anecdotal disclaimer...I do not condone the following, these are just relevant reminiscenses)
My dad, an old fashioned poacher, had crossbows (for their silence) as well as illegal fishing gear (otter boards etc) and also kept guns. He had a shotgun license because he was a crofter, for vermin control and shooting the deer after the crops, but also kept illegal guns as and when they became available. So he had a double barrel 12 bore, a sawn-off, and a rifle. All of these were handy for various killing jobs (strictly of animals of course!) and I wish I had even one of them now. Red deer are a helluva pest in these parts and I don`t own a rifle or shotgun, and trying to find anyone who does who will spend time camping out nights to shoot the buggers is nigh on impossible.
(anecdotal disclaimer...I do not condone the following, these are just relevant reminiscenses)
My dad, an old fashioned poacher, had crossbows (for their silence) as well as illegal fishing gear (otter boards etc) and also kept guns. He had a shotgun license because he was a crofter, for vermin control and shooting the deer after the crops, but also kept illegal guns as and when they became available. So he had a double barrel 12 bore, a sawn-off, and a rifle. All of these were handy for various killing jobs (strictly of animals of course!) and I wish I had even one of them now. Red deer are a helluva pest in these parts and I don`t own a rifle or shotgun, and trying to find anyone who does who will spend time camping out nights to shoot the buggers is nigh on impossible.
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Meyou
Re: Arm the Nation
As much as I'd love to own a firearm, I can see them becoming a liability if we were to ever use them for self defense and the likes.
Short term SHTF, when some authority gets law and order back, somebody may decide that their use was unlawful.
Long term SHTF...well, ammunition is my biggest concern here. A crossbow can use improvised ammunition (Used to shoot pencils out of my old one for plinking) but I can't see somebody improvising a bullet too easily without being an experienced hand loader or somesuch.
Short term SHTF, when some authority gets law and order back, somebody may decide that their use was unlawful.
Long term SHTF...well, ammunition is my biggest concern here. A crossbow can use improvised ammunition (Used to shoot pencils out of my old one for plinking) but I can't see somebody improvising a bullet too easily without being an experienced hand loader or somesuch.
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beefy0978
Re: Arm the Nation
If a sensible person wants to own a rifle, with a little effort they already can.
The big issue in this country is what are you going to defend with it?
Assuming we're considering the WROL TEOTWAWKI; In the American scenario the "rawlesian" approach states it is best to head 300+ miles into the interior where population density is very low and create a "retreat", which would be defensible and fully stocked with $10,000's of stuff. Possibly worth defending and with a military approach it might work. Probably just work for a bit longer.
Apart from a few remote areas in the Scottish highlands there is nowhere in the UK that is more that 48hrs walk, yes walk, from a major residential area. And when the food runs out there, the masses will leave in all directions. So you can expect visitors within 5 days of the last food delivery. Even if you could stay awake permanently you wouldn't be able to reload fast enough. Particularly with the types of firearm we're allowed here.
The focus here has to be on community and seeds. Somehow when the shops are empty we have to have a strategy for gathering the locals together and organising fast. To work together to regenerate a victorian styled society. The quicker it happens the less will starve or get trampled in the chaos. I'm afraid we're better off being kind than cruel in the long run...
The big issue in this country is what are you going to defend with it?
Assuming we're considering the WROL TEOTWAWKI; In the American scenario the "rawlesian" approach states it is best to head 300+ miles into the interior where population density is very low and create a "retreat", which would be defensible and fully stocked with $10,000's of stuff. Possibly worth defending and with a military approach it might work. Probably just work for a bit longer.
Apart from a few remote areas in the Scottish highlands there is nowhere in the UK that is more that 48hrs walk, yes walk, from a major residential area. And when the food runs out there, the masses will leave in all directions. So you can expect visitors within 5 days of the last food delivery. Even if you could stay awake permanently you wouldn't be able to reload fast enough. Particularly with the types of firearm we're allowed here.
The focus here has to be on community and seeds. Somehow when the shops are empty we have to have a strategy for gathering the locals together and organising fast. To work together to regenerate a victorian styled society. The quicker it happens the less will starve or get trampled in the chaos. I'm afraid we're better off being kind than cruel in the long run...
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Carrot Cruncher
Re: Arm the Nation
While I do agree with you in principle, the problem is that not everyone around you will have the same idea and unless you are prepared (and have the ability) to defend your seeds and/or community imo you may not survive long enough to start any rebuildingbeefy0978 wrote:The focus here has to be on community and seeds. Somehow when the shops are empty we have to have a strategy for gathering the locals together and organising fast. To work together to regenerate a victorian styled society. The quicker it happens the less will starve or get trampled in the chaos. I'm afraid we're better off being kind than cruel in the long run...
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beefy0978
Re: Arm the Nation
Mmmmmmmmm.
I would always defend mine. I just think any fight would be best avoided. After all there is nowhere to hide.
That said; it will always be better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6.
I would always defend mine. I just think any fight would be best avoided. After all there is nowhere to hide.
That said; it will always be better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6.
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Carrot Cruncher
Re: Arm the Nation
Totally agree with you, even a simple scratch could be fatal in a world without antibiotics etc.beefy0978 wrote:I just think any fight would be best avoided
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LuqmanNaq
Re: Arm the Nation
I would be over the moon if we were allowed to carry a concealed weapon for self protection. I personally believe that an economic collapse began in 2008 (check out spain for where we will be soon, but not even they have hit the bottom).
After researching into the economic collapse in the USSR and Argentina, everywhere in the UK will become like the bad parts of London, Manchester and Nottingham. Kidnapping, home invasions, armed robberies, and people being killed after they've complied are a common occurence.
There is the rule of law, but the police (due to the state of the economy) are corrupt, ineffectual, slow to respond and are only around after the fact. Ferfal even quotes a newspaper article (that he agrees with based on his personal experience and research), that 9 out of 10 people or a direct family member have been attacked by a criminal in the past year (2009). His own wife has been a victim of armed robbery on several occasions.
In the UK we aren't even allowed to carry a knife that can be practically used for self defence. As the economy gets worse crime will get worse, and we are a disarmed society.
One thing that both Dmitry Orlov and Ferfal emphasize when talking about there experience of living in a post collaspe society is the widespread violent crime.
After researching into the economic collapse in the USSR and Argentina, everywhere in the UK will become like the bad parts of London, Manchester and Nottingham. Kidnapping, home invasions, armed robberies, and people being killed after they've complied are a common occurence.
There is the rule of law, but the police (due to the state of the economy) are corrupt, ineffectual, slow to respond and are only around after the fact. Ferfal even quotes a newspaper article (that he agrees with based on his personal experience and research), that 9 out of 10 people or a direct family member have been attacked by a criminal in the past year (2009). His own wife has been a victim of armed robbery on several occasions.
In the UK we aren't even allowed to carry a knife that can be practically used for self defence. As the economy gets worse crime will get worse, and we are a disarmed society.
One thing that both Dmitry Orlov and Ferfal emphasize when talking about there experience of living in a post collaspe society is the widespread violent crime.
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LuqmanNaq
Re: Arm the Nation
Forgot to post this...
If you believe that our global economy is possibly or probably collapsing, and want to know what security is like in a post collaspe economy, I highly recommend this video...
If you believe that our global economy is possibly or probably collapsing, and want to know what security is like in a post collaspe economy, I highly recommend this video...
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wildone_uk
Re: Arm the Nation
true so trueCarrot Cruncher wrote:Im all for arming myself....it's all the others idiots I worry about