I will try to take some picture tomorrow.
Don't expect much as it doesn't come out well in pictures... Plus I've gone around a corner so it's hard to judge.
The ground is so hard on a good day I can get 5 wheelbarrows of soil away... On a bad day 2
That is why I'm not so scared of a cave in.... I'd need a giant to be jumping up and down with hobnail boots to cause any movement when the soil is dry like it is at the moment
Bunkers - is it just me?
Re: Bunkers - is it just me?
Area 6 bordering to area 8
'Time is a poison - too much of it and you die'
'Time is a poison - too much of it and you die'
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preparedsurrey
- Posts: 544
- Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2014 9:33 pm
- Location: Area 3
Re: Bunkers - is it just me?
I work in construction and we've done some underground "rooms" the biggest was built into a hill side, double story at the rear about 15m by 30m floor area. Covered with about 1.5m of dirt. There is a tremendous amount of calculations followed by vast amounts of concrete blocks, steels, rebar and shuttering before you even start with making it fully water tight and insulated. Just the amount of dirt to get rid of/ store for covering back over is a major issue.
Personally although having your own bunker (explosives store) sounds a good plan it's going to be a major task to acheive without investing massive amounts of cash.
Personally although having your own bunker (explosives store) sounds a good plan it's going to be a major task to acheive without investing massive amounts of cash.
If guns are outlawed then only the outlaws will have guns....
Re: Bunkers - is it just me?
Hi Farnet, now you've said whats actually going on, it sounds very realistic - boys toys version as you say, and why not? They're fun 
Still concerned safety-wise, to be honest, but pix would be great
Still concerned safety-wise, to be honest, but pix would be great
Re: Bunkers - is it just me?
Your ignorance really is scary!farnet wrote:
The ground is so hard on a good day I can get 5 wheelbarrows of soil away... On a bad day 2
That is why I'm not so scared of a cave in.... I'd need a giant to be jumping up and down with hobnail boots to cause any movement when the soil is dry like it is at the moment
Having been involved in the investigation of a worker who was killed in a 1.8m deep trench when it collapsed on him, all I can say is that I hope you have taken out a decent life insurance policy for the benefit of your wife and family.
http://press.hse.gov.uk/2014/developers ... ied-alive/
http://press.hse.gov.uk/2013/director-a ... pse-death/
http://www.hse.gov.uk/press/2007/gnnne46307.htm
http://www.hse.gov.uk/press/2011/coi-sco-05211.htm
etc etc.....
Re: Bunkers - is it just me?
And you my dear fellow are plainly rude
I must be doing something right as it's been stable for just under 3 years so far.....
I must be doing something right as it's been stable for just under 3 years so far.....
Area 6 bordering to area 8
'Time is a poison - too much of it and you die'
'Time is a poison - too much of it and you die'
Re: Bunkers - is it just me?
Where I live there are hundreds of WW2 bunkers and many of them are in great condition, I have had one from time to time and may do so again.
I would certainly not build my own, even if I were to I would use a specialist contractor.
I would certainly not build my own, even if I were to I would use a specialist contractor.
Last edited by Malthouse on Sat Nov 01, 2014 10:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Bunkers - is it just me?
I'm not trying to be rude, but you do not understand the risks involved.farnet wrote:And you my dear fellow are plainly rude
I must be doing something right as it's been stable for just under 3 years so far.....
Because something is ok today does not mean it will be ok tomorrow. That is why under uk health and safety law there is a statutory requirement for all excavations to be inspected by a competent person and signed off before the start of each shift/working day.
Excavations are a major killer, but despite what everyone is telling you, you seem to know best!
As someone who has been involved in investigating workplace deaths, including excavations, I can tell you that it is not an aspect i enjoy. I have also witnessed the shear pain and agony that it causes to the families involved.
Bunkers - is it just me?
I find it strange to see such negativity about farnets intentions here; We all do what we want for whatever reason - I'm pretty sure no one does such a huge project without checking and following professional advice. I'm pretty sure I couldn't just throw up a dwelling without checking regulations, having a planning officer sign it off, etc....
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Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Society has gotten to the point where everybody has a right but nobody has a responsibility
Re: Bunkers - is it just me?
Thanks Janso,
Devonian
My cousin is an architect, both my sister in law and brother in law are engineers (one structural and one mechanical), I work in one (if not THE) most risk averse businesses in the country, and I'm talking to PHD physicists all the time about what I'm doing.
I do take exception to being trolled like that, if you were really concerned rather than be inflammatory (and showing off) you would have sent a private mail and we'd have had a chat. but it has led to bickering.
A lot of commercial ventures are run by companies that underbid competitors, and in doing so are more likely to employ inexperienced people or are more likely to turn a blind eye to short cuts (to increase their margin). the employees themselves don't have an invested interest and also haven't really looked at the big picture so things like that are bound to go wrong... and in any case I could throw figure around myself, but in what context is it, and how many have successfully managed to dig a trench.
The HSE for example, go too far on the safety, in some aspects and that alone bumps the cost up, which in turn causes 'short cuts', I'm not a personal fan of HSE as I experienced an episode one xmas that due to HSE directives a team of engineers weren't allowed to put xmas lights up in their building due to restrictions... these engineers happen to be the ones that manage the 400KV overhead lines and pylons in this country.... common sense... not likely, it caused a knock on effect which I'm not going to go into.
This is my work, I plan it, I'm careful, I've been doing it in little chunks for a few years, I even pressure test the area multiple times before going down there each time ( commercial grade high strength crow scarers do a VERY good job of that, so anything immediately loose will drop in... which only happened one at the beginning). plus I have multiple acros (vertical and horizontal), done shoring and installed lintels, so tell me Mr. what were the circumstances that caused these accidents?.... soft soil (and no proper analysis), failed shoring, inexperience, short cuts, cost cutting, poor workmanship, tools not fit for purpose all of the above? i'm interested
I don't know you and you don't know me, I'm quite happy to be civil, but don't try throwing your weight around and showing off, it doesn't work with me.
Devonian
My cousin is an architect, both my sister in law and brother in law are engineers (one structural and one mechanical), I work in one (if not THE) most risk averse businesses in the country, and I'm talking to PHD physicists all the time about what I'm doing.
I do take exception to being trolled like that, if you were really concerned rather than be inflammatory (and showing off) you would have sent a private mail and we'd have had a chat. but it has led to bickering.
A lot of commercial ventures are run by companies that underbid competitors, and in doing so are more likely to employ inexperienced people or are more likely to turn a blind eye to short cuts (to increase their margin). the employees themselves don't have an invested interest and also haven't really looked at the big picture so things like that are bound to go wrong... and in any case I could throw figure around myself, but in what context is it, and how many have successfully managed to dig a trench.
The HSE for example, go too far on the safety, in some aspects and that alone bumps the cost up, which in turn causes 'short cuts', I'm not a personal fan of HSE as I experienced an episode one xmas that due to HSE directives a team of engineers weren't allowed to put xmas lights up in their building due to restrictions... these engineers happen to be the ones that manage the 400KV overhead lines and pylons in this country.... common sense... not likely, it caused a knock on effect which I'm not going to go into.
This is my work, I plan it, I'm careful, I've been doing it in little chunks for a few years, I even pressure test the area multiple times before going down there each time ( commercial grade high strength crow scarers do a VERY good job of that, so anything immediately loose will drop in... which only happened one at the beginning). plus I have multiple acros (vertical and horizontal), done shoring and installed lintels, so tell me Mr. what were the circumstances that caused these accidents?.... soft soil (and no proper analysis), failed shoring, inexperience, short cuts, cost cutting, poor workmanship, tools not fit for purpose all of the above? i'm interested
I don't know you and you don't know me, I'm quite happy to be civil, but don't try throwing your weight around and showing off, it doesn't work with me.
Area 6 bordering to area 8
'Time is a poison - too much of it and you die'
'Time is a poison - too much of it and you die'
Re: Bunkers - is it just me?
Just a thought and anyone who may know better is welcome to shot this down in flames.
Obviously the simplest , safest way is to dig a huge hole cast the bunker and backfill but would it be possible to build one in the same way as wells were traditionally built? In that I mean a circular brick construction which is put in place then further excavations under the brickwork which is then filled in with more brickwork. The brickwork thus provides the walls of the well / bunker as well as providing shoring during the construction .Of course for a bunker the hole would need to be larger and the walls correspondingly thicker and some sort of waterproofing would need to be put in place internally after the whole thing is constructed and that in itself might be problematic if there is a high water table but in essence would such a thing be practical , seems it could be done with much less disturbance and with a degree of secrecy .
Tin hat now on for the expected flak
Obviously the simplest , safest way is to dig a huge hole cast the bunker and backfill but would it be possible to build one in the same way as wells were traditionally built? In that I mean a circular brick construction which is put in place then further excavations under the brickwork which is then filled in with more brickwork. The brickwork thus provides the walls of the well / bunker as well as providing shoring during the construction .Of course for a bunker the hole would need to be larger and the walls correspondingly thicker and some sort of waterproofing would need to be put in place internally after the whole thing is constructed and that in itself might be problematic if there is a high water table but in essence would such a thing be practical , seems it could be done with much less disturbance and with a degree of secrecy .
Tin hat now on for the expected flak