Advice for a hopeless gardener

Food, Nutrition and Agriculture
ForgeCorvus
Posts: 3035
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2013 11:32 pm

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by ForgeCorvus »

Growing 'stuff' is never cost effective, a farm or market garden is a much more efficient (and therefore cheaper by the unit) way of making food........ However, you can't learn the skills except by doing. Its a 'teach a man to fish' kinda-thing.

Also you know whats gone on and in your food and you can get a lot of satisfaction from the fact that you've cut your food-miles to food-feet.

I'm just dipping my toe in ATM and I quite like it
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jansman
Posts: 13623
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2010 7:16 pm

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by jansman »

ForgeCorvus wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 4:33 pm Growing 'stuff' is never cost effective, a farm or market garden is a much more efficient (and therefore cheaper by the unit) way of making food........ However, you can't learn the skills except by doing. Its a 'teach a man to fish' kinda-thing.

Also you know whats gone on and in your food and you can get a lot of satisfaction from the fact that you've cut your food-miles to food-feet.

I'm just dipping my toe in ATM and I quite like it
I would encourage anyone who has a go at growing food. It is a wonderful skill,and a wonderful hobby. If nothing else,it makes you aware of weather,and the seasons.Like a farmer does; except ,you are a backyard farmer. You WILL have failures - local to me it is tomatoes that aren’t so good,talking to the local gardening mafia! :lol: Initially it costs,but keep going,learn and grow and eat.If the day ever comes that you NEED to grow food,then you are ahead of the pack. Soon, you will learn to save seeds,save work, and money.
In three words I can sum up everything I have learned about life: It goes on.

Robert Frost.

Covid 19: After that level of weirdness ,any situation is certainly possible.

Me.
jennyjj01
Posts: 3429
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:09 pm

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by jennyjj01 »

jansman wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 5:23 pm
ForgeCorvus wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 4:33 pm Growing 'stuff' is never cost effective,...

I'm just dipping my toe in ATM and I quite like it
I would encourage anyone who has a go at growing food. It is a wonderful skill,and a wonderful hobby.
Ok. Better late than never. One planter fully built and installed.
Amazon Prime has done it's magic in getting some swiss chard, Beetroot and spring onion seeds delivered today. Rocket tomorrow.

I discovered that seeds come at all sorts of prices and quantities. It seems that the cost of the seeds is tiny compared to the postage and packing. So a pack of seeds might have contents of 100 or 3,000 of the same seeds at similar price. Only the package seems to vary: Either a nice, nearly empty, retail envelope or a small, fully loaded, barely labelled mylar bag ..... So I now have lots to stash. Even I can't kill 1,500 beetroot (£1.49), can I? :shock:

8 bags of topsoil from Wickes at 10p / litre and 4 bags of compost from the local garden centre, which was giving away pallets, towards the next planter. I love free stuff. ;) ;)

Baby steps, but sowing tomorrow
Graceful Degradation! Prepping's objective summed up in two words. Turning Disaster into Mild Inconvenience by the power of fore-thought

Not Feeling Optimistic. Let me be wrong
jansman
Posts: 13623
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2010 7:16 pm

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by jansman »

jennyjj01 wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 8:48 pm
jansman wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 5:23 pm
ForgeCorvus wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 4:33 pm Growing 'stuff' is never cost effective,...

I'm just dipping my toe in ATM and I quite like it
I would encourage anyone who has a go at growing food. It is a wonderful skill,and a wonderful hobby.
Ok. Better late than never. One planter fully built and installed.
Amazon Prime has done it's magic in getting some swiss chard, Beetroot and spring onion seeds delivered today. Rocket tomorrow.

I discovered that seeds come at all sorts of prices and quantities. It seems that the cost of the seeds is tiny compared to the postage and packing. So a pack of seeds might have contents of 100 or 3,000 of the same seeds at similar price. Only the package seems to vary: Either a nice, nearly empty, retail envelope or a small, fully loaded, barely labelled mylar bag ..... So I now have lots to stash. Even I can't kill 1,500 beetroot (£1.49), can I? :shock:

8 bags of topsoil from Wickes at 10p / litre and 4 bags of compost from the local garden centre, which was giving away pallets, towards the next planter. I love free stuff. ;) ;)

Baby steps, but sowing tomorrow
Do your sowing early or late,given the current heat. SOAK,and I mean SOAK your soil. Give it an hour to ‘ settle’ at least. You can sow your seed then,and all you have to do is keep them damp,not sluice them with water.

Stored seeds: like any foodstuffs,keep them dark/ cool. I use an old biscuit tin on the thrall at the back of our pantry.

Buying seed: many here use Real Seeds,I have,and still grow a couple of pea varieties from them. However,I am tight-fisted.I use : https://www.premierseedsdirect.com/ and latterly,a new kid on the block: https://bargainseeds.co.uk/

The beauty of bargainseeds is that they supply small quantities of seeds at corresponding prices. As much as I like beetroot and carrots,3000 seeds of each won’t be sown before they become unviable. And they do deteriorate overtime.There are many preppers who don’t actually do any gardening,but still buy ‘heirloom seeds in case SHTF’,as if the shops will shut and they will sow their survival seed stash into a piece of ground,then Hey Presto! They expect a week later,the contents of the fruit and veg isle at Tesco. :lol:

So what you are doing,learning about gardening failure, before you may need it ,is a very good move. You will have success,but you most certainly have fails. That’s gardening.Enjoy your project today. :D
In three words I can sum up everything I have learned about life: It goes on.

Robert Frost.

Covid 19: After that level of weirdness ,any situation is certainly possible.

Me.
jennyjj01
Posts: 3429
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:09 pm

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by jennyjj01 »

jansman wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 6:34 am Do your sowing early or late,given the current heat. SOAK,and I mean SOAK your soil. Give it an hour to ‘ settle’ at least. You can sow your seed then,and all you have to do is keep them damp,not sluice them with water.
...
https://www.premierseedsdirect.com/ and latterly,a new kid on the block: https://bargainseeds.co.uk/
Thanks again. Indeed my amazon order turned out to be premierseedsdirect. Prices are slightly different between web site and amazon store, mostly to reflect postage. But with amazon prime, they seem unbeatable. Next time, I'll go direct and think ahead a bit more and save a £1 :)
jansman wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 6:34 am As much as I like beetroot and carrots,3000 seeds of each won’t be sown before they become unviable.
Seems I ONLY ordered 1,500 :) for £1.49 ( or 99p direct), it was a no-brainer.
jansman wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 6:34 am There are many preppers who don’t actually do any gardening,but still buy ‘heirloom seeds in case SHTF’,as if the shops will shut and they will sow their survival seed stash into a piece of ground,then Hey Presto! They expect a week later,the contents of the fruit and veg isle at Tesco. :lol:
I'm counting on my first crop in 3 months :)
Yes. I was one of them. I realise that post apocalypse there are going to be some very disappointed preppers with their stash of seeds wondering when they will be allocated an allotment and then wondering how to get it fruitful before all the dried mash is all gone. Let alone defending their crops from snails and critters and thieves.
jansman wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 6:34 am So what you are doing,learning about gardening failure, before you may need it ,is a very good move. You will have success,but you most certainly have fails. That’s gardening.Enjoy your project today. :D
Baby steps :)
Graceful Degradation! Prepping's objective summed up in two words. Turning Disaster into Mild Inconvenience by the power of fore-thought

Not Feeling Optimistic. Let me be wrong
jansman
Posts: 13623
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2010 7:16 pm

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by jansman »

The cabbage white butterflies are doing the usual; laying eggs so the caterpillars can decimate my brassicas!

If it ain’t weather, it’s pests. Good job we won’t starve without that crop.
In three words I can sum up everything I have learned about life: It goes on.

Robert Frost.

Covid 19: After that level of weirdness ,any situation is certainly possible.

Me.
jennyjj01
Posts: 3429
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:09 pm

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by jennyjj01 »

GillyBee wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 6:02 pm Next year you will do things differently and do better in places, worse in others and learn more

Jenny - You can reuse compost in large boxes/troughs if you are careful.
Well, I'm discovering that I've probably cocked up with the composter. I bought a click together 300l plastic one in October and in my haste, chopped up some basal shoots from my tree to lob into it. I've been feeding the composter with kitchen waste, grass clippings, a few bits of cardboard, a few buckets of leaves etc ( I have lots of leaves*) I frequently give it a stir, but I get the distinct impression that those woody shoots will still be woody shoots for the next few years. Might have worked if I'd shredded them.
It's a science that escapes me. I can't even make things rot properly :(
Going to try some retrospective chopping it up to help it along. With my luck, I'll mince up the worms and make it worse.

Also going to bag up masses of fallen leaves and TRY to make leaf mould.
Graceful Degradation! Prepping's objective summed up in two words. Turning Disaster into Mild Inconvenience by the power of fore-thought

Not Feeling Optimistic. Let me be wrong
jennyjj01
Posts: 3429
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:09 pm

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by jennyjj01 »

ForgeCorvus wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 4:33 pm Growing 'stuff' is never cost effective, a farm or market garden is a much more efficient ...

I'm just dipping my toe in ATM and I quite like it
jansman wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 5:23 pm I would encourage anyone who has a go at growing food.
Ok folks, Is it time, yet, to start ordering more seeds and planning what to sow, where and when? I left it pitifully late this year. I will be googling, but thought I'd also draw on the expertise here. I'm seeking inspiration.HELP! :lol:

[ Edit: Partly answering my own question... https://www.gardenfocused.co.uk/calenda ... alised.php is good]

Wanting to grow veggies but not green leafy ones and not really beans or peas. E.g. want to try courgettes, aubergine? crimson crush tomatoes, maybe some sorts of fruit or berries that I can make wine or jam with.

Also wanting max bang for my buck, as in, I don't see much point growing carrots that I could buy for 19p per kilo.

I DON'T want to get too many crops maturing all at once and would love to find something that I can continuously harvest*, or get some sort of continuous sow and harvest process.or just something that I can leave in the ground till i'm ready to eat it. It'll be in containers, pots and buckets.

So far, my thinking is ...
A herb garden
Garlic
Onions
Chives
Tomatoes
leeks?
celery?
Spinach? or chard
Courgettes?
Aubergine?
Parsnips?
Mushrooms???
Watercress?
I need to figure which of those can coexist in the same container as space is tight. North West England, Sandy soil. Lots of ants and snails..

not planning on growing
spuds
beans
peas
carrots
Graceful Degradation! Prepping's objective summed up in two words. Turning Disaster into Mild Inconvenience by the power of fore-thought

Not Feeling Optimistic. Let me be wrong
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itsybitsy
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Location: East Yorkshire

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by itsybitsy »

In my relatively limited experience of container gardening, beans and courgettes pretty much grow themselves. I had a bumper crop of dwarf yellow beans last year, AND they were quite happy to sit on the vine until I needed them - some of them were there well over a month and didn't suffer at all. I also grew A LOT of tomatoes - all fared relatively well even though I planted them too late. Oddly, though ,the expensive variety (Big Pink) were the only ones that got rot end blossom (I think that's what it's called) - I need to be a bit more consistent with watering. :lol:
jansman
Posts: 13623
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2010 7:16 pm

Re: Advice for a hopeless gardener

Post by jansman »

jennyjj01 wrote: Thu Dec 30, 2021 5:39 pm
ForgeCorvus wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 4:33 pm Growing 'stuff' is never cost effective, a farm or market garden is a much more efficient ...

I'm just dipping my toe in ATM and I quite like it
jansman wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 5:23 pm I would encourage anyone who has a go at growing food.
Ok folks, Is it time, yet, to start ordering more seeds and planning what to sow, where and when? I left it pitifully late this year. I will be googling, but thought I'd also draw on the expertise here. I'm seeking inspiration.HELP! :lol:

[ Edit: Partly answering my own question... https://www.gardenfocused.co.uk/calenda ... alised.php is good]

Wanting to grow veggies but not green leafy ones and not really beans or peas. E.g. want to try courgettes, aubergine? crimson crush tomatoes, maybe some sorts of fruit or berries that I can make wine or jam with.

Also wanting max bang for my buck, as in, I don't see much point growing carrots that I could buy for 19p per kilo.

I DON'T want to get too many crops maturing all at once and would love to find something that I can continuously harvest*, or get some sort of continuous sow and harvest process.or just something that I can leave in the ground till i'm ready to eat it. It'll be in containers, pots and buckets.

So far, my thinking is ...
A herb garden
Garlic
Onions
Chives
Tomatoes
leeks?
celery?
Spinach? or chard
Courgettes?
Aubergine?
Parsnips?
Mushrooms???
Watercress?
I need to figure which of those can coexist in the same container as space is tight. North West England, Sandy soil. Lots of ants and snails..

not planning on growing
spuds
beans
peas
carrots
Do you have a greenhouse? Is it heated? If not,forget aubergines.Even tomatoes.Celery is a bitch too,and has less calories than you put in.Garlic yes,get it in pots to plant out later.Do that NOW,or your crop will be useless. Leeks yes.Perpetual spinach yes. Courgettes if you like them.Parsnips yes.Mushrooms- if you want to waste time and money.

If you don’t eat spuds ,beans and carrots,then don’t grow them,even though they are amongst the best candidates for containers.

I have made the mistakes already .
In three words I can sum up everything I have learned about life: It goes on.

Robert Frost.

Covid 19: After that level of weirdness ,any situation is certainly possible.

Me.