Feeding the masses

Food, Nutrition and Agriculture
jansman
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by jansman » Tue Jul 02, 2019 7:24 pm

I don't worry about anything anymore.Except the kids,and that's part of being a parent.Mass feeding,I am part of everday as my job.Ours is a slick,well oiled machine.In anything less than perfect conditions,mass feeding will be at best,chaos.It will be manned by council- appointed ,well- meaning volunteers.

The Gurdwara highlighted in the YouTube video is a slick,well oiled machine too.SHTF, the well meaning volunteers will be under pressure they are not used to.They will not be required to have food handling certificates,and they will be dealing with stressed and violent people.Think I am kidding? Customers now are rude and aggressive as a matter of course! Chuck all that in with random food borne illness ( never underestimate food poisoning),then a feeding station ain't where I want to be.

I bang on about it,but proper food handling is crucial.
In three words I can sum up everything I have learned about life: It goes on.

Robert Frost.

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Arwen Thebard
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by Arwen Thebard » Wed Jul 03, 2019 7:41 am

None of us are certain about what is coming, we just hope we are ready when it arrives. I've just finished reading "Five days at memorial" first hand accounts from staff and patients who survived the aftermath of hurricane Katrina, working and living inside Memorial hospital in New Orleans. Even with their high degree of readiness and foresight they didnt get through it too well, the longer term help and supplies needed were hopelessly overwhelmed, and that was in one of the best prepared and richest countries in the world. Feeding the masses? Dream on I reckon, it would be everyone for themselves and that usually doesn't work out too well.

jennyjj01 has got it right;

"Actually. no, not pessimistic now I have my preps. Bring it on. Just don't nobble me by sending something I didn't prep for :)"

8-) :lol: 8-) :lol:
Arwen The Bard

"What did you learn today?"

grenfell
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by grenfell » Wed Jul 03, 2019 6:20 pm

Arwen Thebard wrote:
Wed Jul 03, 2019 7:41 am
. I've just finished reading "Five days at memorial" first hand accounts from staff and patients who survived the aftermath of hurricane Katrina, working and living inside Memorial hospital in New Orleans. Even with their high degree of readiness and foresight they didnt get through it too well, the longer term help and supplies needed were hopelessly overwhelmed, and that was in one of the best prepared and richest countries in the world. Feeding the masses? Dream on I reckon,
I wouldn't argue that they made a good job of it far from it but to put a positive spin nobody actually died from starvation . They were hungry and uncomfortable but then one wouldn't expect five star gourmet foods. It may not be in te report you mention but I have read somewhere that they turned down the offer of MRE's from the eu .
Going back to the scenario I can't see a sudden event causing tens of thousand if not millions requiring feeding but I could see more and more people requiring help over a period of time , perhaps after a global economic crash . We've already seen food banks open and their use increase over a relatively short period of a few years.

jansman
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by jansman » Wed Jul 03, 2019 6:27 pm

We pay taxes so as to enable access to things like doctors.My wife is poorly and was referred to A and E as there are no appointments before August!! BY OUR GP!!! If we cannot see a doctor now,what chance of being fed by TPTB in a crisis?
In three words I can sum up everything I have learned about life: It goes on.

Robert Frost.

grenfell
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by grenfell » Wed Jul 03, 2019 6:32 pm

Perhaps if the likes of amazon , Starbucks and google were topay their taxes your wife would have an appointment tomorrow.

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Arwen Thebard
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by Arwen Thebard » Thu Jul 04, 2019 5:54 am

"Going back to the scenario I can't see a sudden event causing tens of thousand if not millions requiring feeding but I could see more and more people requiring help over a period of time , perhaps after a global economic crash . We've already seen food banks open and their use increase over a relatively short period of a few years"

Another good book that describes a widespread medical emergency occurring almost overnight, is "Station Eleven" by Emily St.John Mandel. Well worth reading if you can get your hands on a copy, it's one of the better written apocalypse scenario books IMO.
Arwen The Bard

"What did you learn today?"

grenfell
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by grenfell » Thu Jul 04, 2019 6:54 am

Going slightly at a tangent but still very much about food was listening to an interesting article on the radio recently. The basis of the conversation was how the nature of food is changing and a " revolution" is supposedly coming. Many reasons for the revolution were quoted such as a trend towards eating less meat especially grain fed meats. One thing one contributor said that a difference between the UK and parts of Europe such as Spain , Holland and Denmark is that we still have our landscape . By that he meant that we don't have acres and acres of polytunnels a more common abroad . That's not to say we don't have some but just imagine the moaning if someone wanted to plonk a 50 acre poly tunnel in the Cotswolds for instance.
Talking of the countryside abroad some time ago some friends and myself went to Munich . The airport is a distance away from the city and there is a train to connect. On that journey we didn't see a single animal in the fields . Get to Munich and for the vegetarians in our group it was very difficult to find a meal without half a dead pig in it.

jansman
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by jansman » Thu Jul 04, 2019 6:25 pm

Interesting points there grenfell. Regarding landscape and acres of polytunnels, it is possible that in the interests of food security that could be the U.K. soon. We have a government that tells us we have to reduce carbon footprint, so that’s food miles then?

That could be the feeding of the masses in reality.
In three words I can sum up everything I have learned about life: It goes on.

Robert Frost.

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Arwen Thebard
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by Arwen Thebard » Fri Jul 05, 2019 10:25 am

"Regarding landscape and acres of polytunnels, it is possible that in the interests of food security that could be the U.K. soon. We have a government that tells us we have to reduce carbon footprint, so that’s food miles then? That could be the feeding of the masses in reality."

We have been trying to work out how much ground we genuinely need to be able to grow enough veggies to feed ourselves (2 adults) for a year, given abundant time, limited access to fossil fuel machinery and reasonable soil / location and without any major hiccups.

We reckon it is 1/2 acre of open ground, 1/2 acre covered ground (tunnels) and 1/2 acre mixed fruit orchard. We've had a larger area in the past so based on what we learnt about set aside and rotation, about 2 acres would be more than sufficient. I expect that a certain 'economy-of-scale' would apply if the number of people increased to say 4, but even so, trying to find that much area in the immediate vicinity to major populations, probably wont be easy.

Golf courses? Sports pitches? School fields?
Arwen The Bard

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jansman
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Re: Feeding the masses

Post by jansman » Fri Jul 05, 2019 6:51 pm

Arwen Thebard wrote:
Fri Jul 05, 2019 10:25 am
"Regarding landscape and acres of polytunnels, it is possible that in the interests of food security that could be the U.K. soon. We have a government that tells us we have to reduce carbon footprint, so that’s food miles then? That could be the feeding of the masses in reality."

We have been trying to work out how much ground we genuinely need to be able to grow enough veggies to feed ourselves (2 adults) for a year, given abundant time, limited access to fossil fuel machinery and reasonable soil / location and without any major hiccups.

We reckon it is 1/2 acre of open ground, 1/2 acre covered ground (tunnels) and 1/2 acre mixed fruit orchard. We've had a larger area in the past so based on what we learnt about set aside and rotation, about 2 acres would be more than sufficient. I expect that a certain 'economy-of-scale' would apply if the number of people increased to say 4, but even so, trying to find that much area in the immediate vicinity to major populations, probably wont be easy.

Golf courses? Sports pitches? School fields?
I would agree. A year or four back I rented an acre of land at the North End of the village. I had two polytunnels , some open ground, fowls and my beloved goats.

This country thinks it can feed itself? Maybe, if every scrap of ground was utilised, and the country was accepting of a restricted diet. We need to look at the Cuban Special Period perhaps?
In three words I can sum up everything I have learned about life: It goes on.

Robert Frost.

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