Family car options, BOV advice - discuss please!

[dangerman]

Hey all, I'm hoping to have a little discussion to way up the pros and cons of certain vehicle options for my family. I've got a Hyundai Matrix at the moment, a 1.5 three cylinder diesel and it has been a brilliant little work horse. I'm quite attached to it and I've got it all set up the way I like, with nice tyres, tow bar, roof bars, top box, all my electrics that I want. It has lots of little storage areas for little EDC items etc. Plus, I've had this car for a good few years now and it has proven to be most reliable for it's age. The only thing that has gone wrong was that the starter motor failed at 128000 miles. The other expenses have just been consumables like the clutch, brakes and tyres. The motor is still going strong and has blasted my whole family to Tenby every year in fully laden, luggage, trailer tent etc and it still did 42mpg. It's basically, my favourite car ever. Nobody looks at it twice either, coppers aren't interested. Really low profile which I like.

And so the news came in May that I was to be a dad again, minion number four due in April. I hope this one isn't Chinese like the others. And I have no room in my five seater car for the extra family member. So I need to decide whether to keep my lovely car and just leave the baby behind on family trips, or I'll have to change it for something bigger. My wife doesn't drive so it all comes down to my buying a suitable vehicle.

Money no object I'd be going for a Toyota Land Cruiser - that thing is a no brainer. It actually floats, goes anywhere and has proven to be more indestructible than a tank. But, mpg, tax, insurance and maintenance costs, plus the expense of buying a good one in the first place, price me out of that option all together.

I'd love something that I could use as an all round family, camping, workhorse and camping/BO vehicle. 4x4 is a luxury that I cannot afford and so I'm looking at standard 2WD options. After having such a good experience with Hyundai I'm thinking about the Trajet, but they're old now and I'm not sure if it will be reliable. But I also know that the Kia Sedona is basically the same car.

Anyone got any experience of these type of cars or got any suggestions of anything else that would fit the bill? I'll probably be getting a loan to buy it, but the Matrix just passed it's MOT last week so I'm hoping that means I've got a year to research and choose the car. Budget is vague, it depends on what I can justify the repayments on. I could spend 10k, but then I would be in debt for a long long time. If I spend 2k, I'll be clear of the loan in no time.

I'm also not opposed to something like the Kia Carens, the seven seater. They are pretty much the same as the Matrix and I may just default to if I can't be convinced to justify investment in the bigger car. But, of course, it's a lot less versatile. I wouldn't be able to wild/stealth camp in it or anything like that. It would just be a family A to B vehicle.

[Hamradioop]

my recommendations are:

1. see the vet or buy two bricks

2. take a look at the Citroen Berlingo available in 5 and 7 seats. Loads of room and there are drop in camping conversions available from http://www.spacecampervans.com/?gclid=C ... oCq37w_wcB and here http://www.amdro.co.uk/products/boot-ju ... 10_15.html.
Jester Bush craft's you tube video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mvs5hxR8v4c Cost from 13,335

[dangerman]

That's a good little idea for the boot, but I think all I need is something minimal - all that cooker business and the never to be used dining configuration seems over complicated. I'll have a look and see if there is a version that just has the bed part so I could stick a blow up mattress on it or something. And that bloke really needs some curtains or something! He'll feel a bit silly waking up with his morning glory to the site of dog walkers peering through his window (this happened to me once).

Car is only five seats though. Need something six seats minimum.

[preparedsurrey]

I know of 2 Kia's that have failled expensively on the gearboxs - both had been well serviced and not driven hard. A late Toyota Surf (not with the 2.4 engine) would probably suit, they're a lot cheaper than a landcruiser
There are plenty of cheaper 4x4's about but at the £2k price range they are all going to need regular work doing, which if you can't DIY is going to prove expensive.

4 kids - didn't you figure out what causes it yet?

[Hoipoloi]

Get yourself a crew cab Vivaro. Six seats and still room for half a dozen bikes in the back.

[Jamesey1981]

Seconded on the van, although also have a look at Mazda bongos, grey import but popular so there's loads of them and most insurers won't sting you, Japanese reliability, four wheel drive (road biased 4x4, you won't be green laning but you'll be ok in the snow) and various configurations, from full on camper to people carrier and everywhere in between. Chances are you have a specialist somewhere near you that deals in them, they have a pretty good following.

[dangerman]

The gearbox issue doesn't necessarily put me off the Kia, I know they have their problems. The way I see it, as long as I'm aware of the potential repair costs then I can way them up against the initial investment and running costs. Kia are one of the cheapest cars money can buy, and the gearbox is the only thing anyone ever mentions.

I'm much more wary of Fords and Peugeots etc. They can be mega expensive just for routine servicing or manufacturer denied faults. Like my mates two year old mondeo who had to pay near 2K to replace a clutch. Or my mate who bought a Peugeot 206 brand spanking new and it spent 12 of it's first 36 months in the shop being fixed... Then it ran out of warranty. Electrical problems with that one.

I'm not opposed to the 4x4 Toyota, but I think it's an expense that I could invest in something more useful. I do love the Surf/Hilux/Landcruiser, they're all available at the right money and I really love Toyota, especially those 80's and 90's models. I might go and look at some and research maintenance costs. I know they're going to need fixing somewhat, this is one of the things that puts me off. But the road tax does too, and the insurance. Anyone know much about the Estima/Lucida/Previa ones? They look good but I have no idea what they're like to keep on the road.

I also like the idea of the vivaro, it's lovely to drive and has tons of capacity. I drive the minibus version in work (a big yellow one) and I did consider it. But again, it goes wrong a lot. Engine issues on the new ecodrive system seems to be the main one. Whenever it goes back to the garage it's a minimal £300 for whatever they're doing to it (plugging in a laptop) and they just say "take it on longer motorway drives a couple of times a week". And I've lost count of the amount of brakes it's gone through and it's only done 60k.

Maybe I'm being too fussy?

Right now I'm still thinking Hyundai Trajet. I could get one with about 70k, ten years old for less than a grand. Then I could stick one of those boot camper things in it, tint the windows and still have money to service it, fix any major issues and also have money in the bank to fix it when it breaks. I wonder if they have the same gearbox as the Kia.

[preparedsurrey]

Doing any sort of mileage the road tax expense is.minimal it's only the cost of 3 tanks of fuel a year you could save that by not having a heavy right foot. If you aren't comfortable with doing your own maintenance servicing on anything will be expensive

[unsure]

for under 2 grand , you can get a td5 discovery or if you want old school , a 300 . the 300 is old but reliable and runs on veg oil so cheaper than diesel at the minute . its all about what you want to drive .

[dangerman]

Road tax is a pain in the arse for me. I only do about 6000 miles a year because I ride my motorbike as often as I can. I suppose I could absorb the cost, but I could say that about anything and if possible I'd rather avoid any added and avoidable expenses which don't provide any value for money whatsoever. I've heard the Discovery is one of the most unreliable Land Rovers ever anyway - in fact, I've never heard anyone say anything good about them until I started taking an interest in the prepper community. Some preppers seem to go for Jeeps too, which I think are Chryslers. Which are hands down the most dodgy manufacturer ever. I think. Aren't they?

I've been looking at VW transporters today as well. Not cheap, but there maybe an argument for the way they hold their value. It looks like I might be able to buy one, use it for a couple of years and then sell it on with no depreciation. Food for thought...