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Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:47 am
by seadog
Apologies if this has already been covered, but I thought it was important that we are all aware of what our Government is planning.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/01/heal ... itain.html is an article that shows concern regarding mixing vaccination types, which is totally untested.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -jabs.html is an article that denies such action is being considered, but on reading the article, it seems the Government is intending to run down this path
Your thoughts?
Re: Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:00 pm
by jansman
All I can say is that one report is American ( and their view of the uk isn’t the place I live , mostly), and the other is the Beano- sorry Daily Mail. I’ll not take either seriously.
Re: Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 2:35 pm
by Arzosah
There's a report in The Independent, describing what seadog has found.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/m ... r-BB1cpScU
(I know it's headed msn, but on the page, it's headed The Independent.) I can't yet find the PHE statement to the NHS, which they say is dated 31 December, I'll keep on looking.
Re: Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 2:44 pm
by Arzosah
Here we go. This page
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... ctitioners
I opened up the document, and on p14 is this:
Interchangeability of different COVID-19 vaccines
There is no evidence as to the interchangeability of the different COVID-19 vaccines
although studies are underway. Therefore, every effort should be made to determine
which vaccine the individual received and to complete with the same vaccine.
For individuals who started the schedule and who attend for vaccination at a site where
the same vaccine is not available, or where the first product received is unknown, it is
reasonable to offer a single dose of the locally available product. This option is preferred
if that individual is likely to be at immediate high risk or is considered unlikely to attend
again. In these circumstances, as both the Pfizer-BioNTech and AstraZeneca vaccines
are based on the spike protein of the virus, it is likely that the second dose will help to
boost the response to the first dose. Further doses of vaccine are not required unless
additional information becomes available.
My added emphasis. There's been *no* research done, there couldn't have been, but they're bringing the concept into the public domain, and I'd bet a great deal of money that it will happen, even though the actual words used say the opposite. Reading between the lines, the message is the opposite of the words used, to my mind.
Re: Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:34 pm
by jansman
It’s like a feeding frenzy isn’t it? Gimme vaccine!Gimme vaccine! Doesn’t matter if it’s effective, doesn’t matter if there are side effects- and the media whips all that speculation and anxiety up to boot. I take everything in the news with a big pinch of salt. After all, good news doesn’t sell. Everything about this issue is uncertain, and folks take the news as read.
My wife and I have decided to stand back, watch and wait. IF, and I suspect it’s a big IF,( although nothing would surprise me in the name of ‘Public Health’) there is a move to mix untried, untested and different vaccines, then we are not having it. These pharmaceutical companies have a get out of jail card, so it doesn’t matter to them if sections of the population have adverse reactions- or worse. I also suspect there will be a push by government to ‘get-the-job-done’ in the same way that we were going to be getting 100,000 tests per day. Not.
Wait and see.
Re: Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:19 pm
by pseudonym
jansman wrote: ↑Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:34 pm
My wife and I have decided to stand back, watch and wait. IF, and I suspect it’s a big IF,( although nothing would surprise me in the name of ‘Public Health’) there is a move to mix untried, untested and different vaccines, then we are not having it. These pharmaceutical companies have a get out of jail card, so it doesn’t matter to them if sections of the population have adverse reactions- or worse. I also suspect there will be a push by government to ‘get-the-job-done’ in the same way that we were going to be getting 100,000 tests per day. Not.
Wait and see.
Same here.
I know that the trails didn't inclde anyone with my medical history, so the effects are unkown....
Re: Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:36 pm
by jansman
pseudonym wrote: ↑Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:19 pm
jansman wrote: ↑Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:34 pm
My wife and I have decided to stand back, watch and wait. IF, and I suspect it’s a big IF,( although nothing would surprise me in the name of ‘Public Health’) there is a move to mix untried, untested and different vaccines, then we are not having it. These pharmaceutical companies have a get out of jail card, so it doesn’t matter to them if sections of the population have adverse reactions- or worse. I also suspect there will be a push by government to ‘get-the-job-done’ in the same way that we were going to be getting 100,000 tests per day. Not.
Wait and see.
Same here.
I know that the trails didn't inclde anyone with my medical history, so the effects are unkown....
And you are ( I guess) classed as vulnerable? The very folks that need to be protected!
I am not knocking the vaccination programme, it is a natural progression after all. The testing etc. though is not thorough enough. As I have stated previously, the fastest vaccine ever to get to market, was the Mumps in 1967 took 4 years. The Covid took five minutes! I’ll wait thanks.
Re: Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 6:07 pm
by scoobie
jansman wrote: ↑Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:36 pm
pseudonym wrote: ↑Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:19 pm
jansman wrote: ↑Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:34 pm
My wife and I have decided to stand back, watch and wait. IF, and I suspect it’s a big IF,( although nothing would surprise me in the name of ‘Public Health’) there is a move to mix untried, untested and different vaccines, then we are not having it. These pharmaceutical companies have a get out of jail card, so it doesn’t matter to them if sections of the population have adverse reactions- or worse. I also suspect there will be a push by government to ‘get-the-job-done’ in the same way that we were going to be getting 100,000 tests per day. Not.
Wait and see.
Same here.
I know that the trails didn't inclde anyone with my medical history, so the effects are unkown....
And you are ( I guess) classed as vulnerable? The very folks that need to be protected!
I am not knocking the vaccination programme, it is a natural progression after all. The testing etc. though is not thorough enough. As I have stated previously, the fastest vaccine ever to get to market, was the Mumps in 1967 took 4 years. The Covid took five minutes! I’ll wait thanks.
You can't compare 1967 to now. Many things in the late 60s would have taken significantly longer than it would today.
Never have we had so much collaboration and focused work on a vaccine. Institutions didn't have to go through the lengthy process of funding applications/grants (which takes years) . Money was thrown at the problem. Obstacles were removed. Traditionally most of the time taken in developing a vaccine is actually just waiting, not the science or trials bit.
The technology and the work on the vaccines had been underway for years before covid came along. The vaccines just needed to be tweaked for covid.
I would imagine most people getting a vaccine from Monday in the UK will be the Oxford one. I doubt the Pfizer one will be used much now if at all.
If I was lucky enough to be offered the vaccine, I would happily have it. (I'm fairly close to the research and science side so I'm happy with the science and the process).
Re: Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 6:30 pm
by jansman
scoobie wrote: ↑Sat Jan 02, 2021 6:07 pm
jansman wrote: ↑Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:36 pm
pseudonym wrote: ↑Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:19 pm
Same here.
I know that the trails didn't inclde anyone with my medical history, so the effects are unkown....
And you are ( I guess) classed as vulnerable? The very folks that need to be protected!
I am not knocking the vaccination programme, it is a natural progression after all. The testing etc. though is not thorough enough. As I have stated previously, the fastest vaccine ever to get to market, was the Mumps in 1967 took 4 years. The Covid took five minutes! I’ll wait thanks.
You can't compare 1967 to now. Many things in the late 60s would have taken significantly longer than it would today.
Never have we had so much collaboration and focused work on a vaccine. Institutions didn't have to go through the lengthy process of funding applications/grants (which takes years) . Money was thrown at the problem. Obstacles were removed. Traditionally most of the time taken in developing a vaccine is actually just waiting, not the science or trials bit.
The technology and the work on the vaccines had been underway for years before covid came along. The vaccines just needed to be tweaked for covid.
I would imagine most people getting a vaccine from Monday in the UK will be the Oxford one. I doubt the Pfizer one will be used much now if at all.
If I was lucky enough to be offered the vaccine, I would happily have it. (I'm fairly close to the research and science side so I'm happy with the science and the process).
I’ll grant that we are more technologically advanced now. However, patience is a virtue. I shall be patient. We had the symptoms back in March.We were not particularly ill. We shall exercise caution in the here and now in the light of mutant strains of the virus.
I will say though, that the rather rushed push of vaccine, is VERY politically expedient.
We shall see.
Re: Mix and Match Covid Vaccination
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 7:08 pm
by jansman
It’s academic if the vaccine cannot be delivered in double- quick -time!
Coronavirus: Medics complain of 'bureaucracy' in bid to join Covid vaccine effort
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55516277